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Last Post Dec 14, 2006 10:59 AM by: mghorner
Replies: 46
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schmidt@vcn.com
Posts: 1
(1 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Feb 10, 2003 8:17 AM
You're probably referring to a twin LENS reflex, where two nearly identical lenses are stacked. The top lens is for viewing (image reflected off a mirror onto a viewing glass) and the bottom lens is the actual taking lens (image exposed to the film). These are usually 6x6 (120/220 film) format cameras and were very popular in the 50s and 60s and even through the 70s.

Prime examples were Rolleiflex and Rolleicords, Yashicamats and Mamiya C330s and other variants. All the above remain good viable cameras for use today. Rollei even came back with one a couple years ago based on the Rolleiflex for around $3,000.
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daleh@surewest.net
Posts: 3
(2 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Feb 12, 2003 9:27 PM
A twin lens reflex of older vintage is a great way to get into medium format photography for a very low cost.
I bought a very nice Yashicamat 124 from an Ebay auction for just over $120 not long ago that was in near new condition. There are always active listings for old Rolleiflexes and Rolleicords as well as Yashicamats in the Medium Format section.
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mullin@selway.umt.edu
Posts: 2
(3 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Feb 13, 2003 8:41 AM
A twin lens reflex is also a great tool with which to learn composition, especially if (like most) there's a grid on the focusing screen. That's true for several reasons:

1) the big, easy to see image looks more like a real PICTURE than it does like an image in an ordinary camera viewfinder. You think about what you see in terms of what a picture looks like, not just concentrating on the subject.

2) That picture on the focusing screen is reversed left to right-- this actually helps you think of it AS a picture more easily. Of course, if it's a good-looking composition reversed, it will still be a good looking composition when you print the photo, and then it will be turned around the right way.

3) With a single-lens reflex, the image on the focusing screen vanishes at the exact instant of exposure. With a TLR, it's always visible. With practice, you can see the exact effect of flash through the finder. A p&s camera does that too, of course, but there you are just looking through a finder.

4) The grid on the screen, if you have one, shows you ahead of time what that big square negative will look like if you crop it as a horizontal, or a vertical shot. No need to turn the camera from one position to the other.
5) The fact that you do not have a zoom lens is actually an advantage in learning photography. You do NOT get the same results by staning in one place and zooming back and forth that you do by walking forward and backward. Any camera with a fixed focal length will teach you that, but the grid feature mentioned above makes the TLR an especially good teaching tool. If you want to see what a long zoom would do, just look at one of the little squares on the grid. Or look at a block of four squares ( 2x2) or a block of 9 squares (3x3) to see what a shorter zoom would give you. Now compare those results to what you get by walking forwards and backwards.
Add in the low cost, and the good-quality prints , and you can see why for many years the twin-lens reflex was the camera on which a lot of photo courses started their students. --Chris
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bjskidz7
Posts: 5
(4 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Mar 19, 2003 8:59 PM
This answer has very much so , been answered.

I Offered an additional comment-
I had no Idea this Board existed - Even after 2+ years as a member -

It is a breath of fresh air to hear fellow enthusiast
speaking almost my every word -IF HAD REPLIED to same question !

I absolutely Love the tinseled, Vintage Camera Results- I do pray the companies such as KODAK - continue to make the vintage film available - Rare yes - but it has accessibility - If You have a have the strong desire to Create with the Old twin lens reflex.

So Many Would be amazed at the results and the ease of using one .

"BEAUTY" and the Twin Reflex camera {{Such as a Rolliflex"- Not predictable "No",!!!
Not by all the Tech features available But no other site quite the same for me on the face of this earth }} If you get the chance to put your skills into one - Go For it - It can never be the same for Photography as you know it in 2003 ,IT IS ,,accomplished BY a walk into the past , and you will never look at that strange Vintage Camera the way you use to ??
Beauty , available and unpredictable results , come with the Twin Reflex
by any other means your photo would never match up to this walk back through the earlier years
Sorry about being Long Winded -
Bjskidz7@adelphia.com Pro since 1988.

as i had stated- I have my first visit to this site







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wasleys
Posts: 77
(5 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Jun 4, 2003 6:39 AM
Don't forget the little Russian Lubitel!

Later ones come very cheap (older ones may be "collectors' items"). Bodies are plastic and they are a bit awkward to use, but the lens is surprisingly good for a camera of this price.

Anyone wanting to know if TLR photography is for them could try one of these as a taster before spending serious money on a 'proper' camera.
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fineart-auctions
Posts: 1
(6 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Mar 27, 2004 10:10 AM
I absolutely love my Rollei, and would highly recommend getting one for your collection, though they have been known to have their shutters be a little off, you can have it reset by a professional for around $100 I believe.

-ian
www.iangrantphotography.com
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cfpictures
Posts: 15
(7 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Mar 27, 2004 9:43 PM
TWO reflex cameras glued together
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jjimbobb
Posts: 1
(8 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Apr 3, 2004 7:08 PM
Don't forget the Japan, the Mamiya twins are real work horses. I owned 3 to use in my wedding work. The meet thing is the amount of parts available used. The interchangeable lenses offer lots of flexibility.
js
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romans-828
Posts: 3
(9 of 46)

what is a twin reflex camera?

Apr 10, 2004 5:00 PM
The Lubitel is an excellent TLR. When the Russians took over Germany after WWII, they "liberated" a number of outstanding engineers from the ZEISS company... the optics in the Lubitel are at least as good as Zeiss although the mechanics are a little rough. These are on EBAY for ~ $25 and are a great buy and easy to use.
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cgmullin
Posts: 1,479
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what is a twin reflex camera?

Apr 12, 2004 7:32 AM
The Lubitel is a copy of the Voigtlander Brilliant. It's all moad of plastic, and instead of a real ground glass, it has a brilliant finder, with a little ground-glass circle in the middle for focusing. Much brighter than an all-groundglass screen, but the center spot is pretty dim. The 3-element f4.5 lens is slower than most TLR lenses.

This is NOT generally considered to be a very sharp lens. But at f8 and f11, it's plenty sharp enough for most people. The same can be said of most other 3-element f4.5 lenses, of course.

When it was in production, the Russians themselves thought of the Lubitel as a good camera to give a 12-year-old who wants to learn about photography, and it still is that. Personaly, I'd advise a TLR with a full-focusing screen. But the finder on such a camera will not be as bright, and the camera will likely cost more than a Lubitel. If you don't make prints more than 10x10, and can shoot at f8 or f11, any extra sharpness you would get with a better lens really won't matter much to many people.
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brenttannehill
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(11 of 46)

Re: what is a twin reflex camera?

May 21, 2004 8:39 PM
Another good TLR is the Minolta Autocord. It has a selinium light meter and takes pretty darn good pictures. It usually sells for about $60-$80 on ebay. It weighs hardly anything, (since it's mostly air), and there's no sound when you click the shutter, so people doen't even know that you're taking a picture.
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ladyphotographer1
Posts: 9
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Re: what is a twin reflex camera?

May 28, 2004 6:52 AM
What is anybody's opnion of the Rollei and what is a good ebay price for one in good condition and working. Can still buy the film?
Del
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schmidt_photo
Posts: 1,727
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Re: what is a twin reflex camera?

May 28, 2004 8:23 AM
Rollei is one of the best names in cameras. When I switched mostly to shooting digital I kept three film cameras for special uses, 35mm (Canon EOS-3), 4x5 (Graphic View) and 6x6 (Rolleiflex SL66). These are the cameras I use when digital just won't quite do the job. Of those, the Rollei is by far the finest one, even though it's old as the hills.

Since you asked on this thread, I assume you're asking about a Rolleicord or twin lens Rolleiflex. Both are good cameras. The Rolleicord was the "cheap" version, but I've used (and owned) several and never had one I wasn't happy with. Some have better lenses than others, and I can't tell you which are the best, but I'd assume it's the later ones produced.

If you get a Rollei just be sure it's one that uses 120 film. That will be available for a long time, as it's what many professionals still use today. It gives you a 2.25x2.25 frame. (There was also a "Baby Rollei" made that used smaller film. Don't get it for a user.)

Rolleis were made for a long time. The earlier ones often sell for well under $100 and the latest ones may go for much more. The Rolleiflex twin lens was brought back into production a few years ago and sold for around $2500 if I remember right.
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cgmullin
Posts: 1,479
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Re: what is a twin reflex camera?

May 28, 2004 8:28 AM
You can still buy the 120 film which fits most Rolleiflex and Rolleicord cameras. Any real camera store will sell it, or hundreds of people sell it mail order. May professional photograhpers still use 120 film, and it will be made for many years to come.

There are are a lot of different Rollei cameras, and all are well made, but the feature set differs. What I would advise getting is a Rolleiflex 3.5F In MY humble opinion, this is the best camera ever made if you want to do all kinds of photography with one non-zooming lens!

People who have never owned a Rolleiflex often think that the Yashica TLRs are almost the same thing, but cheaper. That's like saying that a bottom-line Yashica SLR is almost the same thing as a Nikon F3. It's ture that you can take pretty good pictures with either one, but there really IS a difference! Getting back to twin-lens reflexes, the 3.5F has many, many, expensive little features that just make it more convenient to use. Incidentally, many of those features have been removed from the current Rollei 2.8FX model. Here are some things the 3.5 will do, but a current $3500 2.8FX will NOT:

1) The 3.5F (or a 2.8F, which is the same camera with an 80mm f2.8 lens instead of a 75mm f3.5 lens) has auto film loading. You slide the backing paper through rollers, onto the takeup spool and close the back and turn the crank. All other 120 cameras, including the Rollei 2.8GX and 2.8FX make you keep the back open when you wing the film until some arrows on the paper backing match up with littl moards in the camera. If you are in a hurry to reload, not having to do that can make a real difference.

2) The focusing hood on a 3.5F or a 2.8F has a built-in critical focuser for the sportsfinder. Using the sports finder with these cameras is a much better deal than using a prism. The prism makes the camera big and heavy. With most TLRs, even the current Rolleis, you lose visual focusing if you use the sports finder. The design used on the 3.5F probably cost several dollars extra to build, and they dropped it.

3) The 2.8F and 3.5F have an automatic depth of field indicator, that shows you exactly what will be in focus as you change diapram settings. The current mosels just have a scale. That's still more than you get on a modern camera with a zoom leens, but the older camera's system is better-- and was more expensive to make.

I could go on.

The 2.8GX and 2.8FX do have one big feature that the older cameras lack-- through-the lens light metering. That's not as big a deal as you think, though. The 3.5F has a meter that is very carefully matched to the exact angle of view of the lens. If you take the camera and point it ALMOST at a bare lightbulb on the ceiling, and then move the bulb into the finder, you can see how this works. Just like an averaging TTL meter! The TTL flash metering you get with the current 2.8FX is not duplicated on the 3.5 F naturally, but if you have an automatic flash unit that probably does not matter too much.

You may have wondered why I advise the 3.5F over the 2.8F. That light meter is one reason. They used exactly tthe same meter on the 2.8F, carefully calibrated for a slightly wider angle lens than the camera really has! So people with 2.8F cameras complain that the meter doesn't cover the angle of view correctly. Rollei originally introduced the 3.5F as their ultimate camera. But Hassleblads had a faster 80mm f2.8 lens, and that hurt Rollei sales. So they added an 80mm f2.8 model of their own. It uses bigger filters and accessories. Those and the camera itself are a little bigger and heavier. And the difference between 80mm and 75mm means that there will be a few occasions when you can't step back quite far enough to get everything you want into the pictue with the 2.8F, but youcan with the 3.5F. To get a tighter composition with the 3.5F, either step toward the subject, or just crop the edge of the picture.

The lenses on all of these top-line Rollei TLRs are superb, and you can get closeup sets which give you auto parallax correction. Any of the four models I've mentioned will give great results. But the TTL models are much more expensive. You can get a good 3.5F for under $450.

NOTE! Not all 3.5 Rolleis are really the 3.fF. In fact, most are not. the four cameras I've been talking about all uave either Zeiss Planar lenses, or Schneider Xenotar lenses. So did the 2.8E and 3.5E and their variants, but only the F , FX, and GX models have fully cross-coupled light meters. Meters found on other models are built-in but not totally coupled. And there are many other Rollei cameras with Zeiss Tessar and Schneider Xenar lenses. Those cameras are only about half as expensive. They are well made, but they lack some of the features of the 2.8F and the 3.5F

If you still want more, I'll be happy to tell you at great length just WHY this is the best camera ever for general pheotgraphy with one fixed-focal-length lens. Until the days of high quality wide-to-tele zooms, it was the best camera period, if you did not want to change lenses. --Chris
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