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Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
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Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 30, 2009 02:07 PM
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Today I received an email from EPN stating that I have to comply with their new policy changes about trademarked domains and having any trademarks before the third slash in my URLS (domain.com/here/here/not here This is essentially 100% of my sites. Only a few have trademarks in the domains (registered a long time ago in 06 before I knew better)... but those that aren't have brand names after the first slash for SEO purposes which I is common sense and isnt violating trademarks in any way. This month is rounding out to be my best month so far with EPN, about $3500 in revenue so I'm sorry to have to go but I knew this day would come eventually. The EPN business model just isn't sustainable, I've read it time and again on these boards. I'm thinking that moving to Amazon would be a good temporary fix until I can figure out some better merchants to work with at this point.
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(25 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 2, 2009 10:23 AM
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> This month is rounding out to be my best month so far with EPN, about $3500 in revenue so I'm sorry to have to go but I knew this day would come eventually. The EPN business model just isn't sustainable, I've read it time and again on these boards. > > I'm thinking that moving to Amazon would be a good temporary fix until I can figure out some better merchants to work with at this point. The domain name certainly plays a part in your search engine rankings, but it's only a small part. The keywords and content are your real traffic drivers. I have domains that are virtually unrealted to the content, but yet they rank well because of my keywords and content. Find new domains, set them up and migrate your content to them. Put placeholders at the original domains that explain you have moved to new domains to better serve your visitors/customers. Use a .htaccess file to redirect any incoming links to that placeholder (as opposed to your host serving up a 404 error) I have a popular site, that ranks high, and I just did this. In my opinion, this domain wasn't a trademark violation, but it gets enough traffic and business that I didn't want to take the chance. It had the word "bay" at the end - completely, totally and obviously NOT related to eBay, but I changed it on my own, to avoid any potential issues. I see a steady amount of traffic hitting the placeholder page and then continuing on to the new domain. My point is, you obviously have a good combination of keywords and content, don't throw it away just because your annoyed with their new rules. ~ Gary
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(24 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 08:22 PM
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> Using scripting language such as php or asp and a 301 header redirect, I have never had any of the major search engines take more than 3 days to move at least 90% of my pages in thier indexes. It's quite painless. dvd2sl, I have a question regarding forwarding a domain to another of my sites. In a different context, I have done PHP header 301 redirects, but for forwarding traffic from one domain to another, I use masked URL forwarding in the DNS settings at my registrar. With respect to SEO and SE indexing, which technique would be preferred in this instance of forwarding TM-issue domains to our own TM-free sites, and why?
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(23 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 04:17 PM
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Take a look at this thread on another site from 2003 http://www.northamericanmotoring.com/forums/182179-post636.html To ensure our trademarks are protected, we ask that third parties engaged in commercial MINI-related activities make clear that they are not officially licensed, and limit themselves to “fair use” textural references to MINI in their literature. For example, a commercial website may not use MINI in its domain name or tradename, nor may it make trademark use of the MINI mark. It must ensure there is no suggestion that it is an authorized, licensed, sponsored or affiliated MINI portal. Neither enthusiast nor commercial sites may use the MINI logo or any imitation thereof without permission. Pretty clear-cut permission, though they may have changed their policy. The magic phrase "Not affliated with" appearing prominently on your page can do wonders too. Get a lawyer.
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(22 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 03:18 PM
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If I think I might be infringing, I am. Yes. No question. But I am also infringing when I think I'm not. My minitrains domain as been approach by BMWUSA. I had to cease it. Fait enough. But the answers I had from BMWUSA was I can use "cooper" but not "mini". I'm thinking about infringing more by using "cooper" than "mini". I was wrong. To answer one of your quyestion, yes, I want to stay away from infringment. My domains have no obvious brand name in them but a bunch of trademarked words like "mini" or "rr". That's why I did receive my comply or terminate email... I shut down a bunch of sites because I DO NOT KNOW if I can use "rr" or "mini" or "model" or...etc...etc..They are trademarked...
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(21 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 02:11 PM
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but buying "myBay.com" and setting up a blog all about your life living on the beach in Tampa is not. but then promoting eBay on that site is. because it brings the context back to ebay. I should then have no problem of infringement using mini-cooper.com (or min-icooper.com or coopermini.com, etc...) to sell wireless devices. If you are actually serious when you say that then it is in your best interest to completely avoid EVERY trademark you can lookup in the database. Clearly you don't get this at all. Any of those would generate a lawsuit or at least a letter, probably within 24 hours. You can use mini for many things. Using cooper is less flexible. Using them both together is asking for it. As for RR: Did you search the USPTO database? Did you notice that it's trademarked dozens of times by different companies for different purposes? Does that mean that every railroad crossing sign has to be taken down? No. If you think you might be infringing. you are. But more to the point, why do you want to attract that sort of attention? Go to google. Type in trademark infringement and start reading.
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(20 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 08:14 AM
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Also, the problem I have is for 2 letters: rr This 2 letters are in the database, so infringement is there. I just didn't know since I thought it was only for brand names. Lots of 2 letters are trademarked...even yj An account having a domain with yj in it could be terminated by ePN as well...But I think people think only about brand names...
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(19 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 07:59 AM
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Kind of tricky. I should then have no problem of infringement using mini-cooper.com (or min-icooper.com or coopermini.com, etc...) to sell wireless devices. Not only because cooper is not reg (minicooper is - mini-cooper is not) but because the reg word "mini" has nothing to do with wireless devices. What about plurial? If "model", "book", etc...are trademarked, is models.com or storeofbooks.com safe? Let me know if I'm wrong since this issue is very confusing for me...
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(18 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 07:41 AM
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I think what profitstats is trying to say is that "context" plays a big role in wether or not a registered name is being misused. Many brand names are obvious and can't really be used in any other context, but some are not. "eBay" is probably one of the most recognized examples of this. Buying the domain "iBay.com" and setting up your own auction site is an obvious infringement on eBay, but buying "myBay.com" and setting up a blog all about your life living on the beach in Tampa is not.
But that's not to say that eBay (or any other corporation) won't try to strong-arm you into giving it up if they conclude that their lawyers are bigger than your lawyers and you won't be able to afford even the preliminary legal expenses to fight them on it.
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Thin isn't thin unless it's OneLung Thin
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(17 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 05:55 AM
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Forgot to mention what I saw in another forum regarding the use of the word " ebay " in a domain name like littlebayonets.com or jambondebayonne.com... Interesting...
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(16 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 05:51 AM
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Agree. But people do not necesarely know every context to all of them. BMW trademarked the word " mini " for " land vehicules ". A train is a " land vehicule ". Now, try to sell ebay model trains at minitrains.com and see how ePN will react. BTW, " model " is reg as well. So don't try modeltrains.com neither...
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(15 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 05:23 AM
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> If it's in the trademark database and you use it, you will be terminated by ePN. ridiculous Trademarks are all about usage, just because someone has a particular phrase registered doesn't mean that they own it. They may have the exclusive right to use the phrase in a particular area of business, but they don't have exclusive rights in all areas.
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(14 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Aug 1, 2009 04:24 AM
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It doesn't matter what others try to do. If it's in the trademark database and you use it, you will be terminated by ePN. If "rr"(*) is in the database and you have it in your domain, expect an email from ePN for trademark infringement. Period. (*) or one of the millions words in there...
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(13 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 31, 2009 06:48 PM
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only if you dont want to fight them. There are thousands of active domains containing "mini" McDonalds sues people over using Mc and loses some of the time, even in the food biz. Hormel lost trying to sue an anti-spam company over spam trademark. Apple won when sued by the Beatles over use of apple logo for itunes Lego tried to claim the shape of the bricks was a trademark and lost. google the suit over "window shopping"
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(12 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 31, 2009 04:41 PM
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Not always. "mini" is not reg(*) but BMW will not let you use it since they bought Mini Cooper. I had to cease my minitrains domain to BMW for the sum of $30... (*) USPTO site doesn't show it as reg'ed...
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(11 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 31, 2009 12:34 PM
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> Do people know the hundreds of thousands words that are trademarked out there?? > So will you be terminated by ebay if your domain is myRRstore.com ?? With any business you have to do your due diligence. A simple search of registered trademarks will let you know if the domain you're considering buying violates trademarks: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/gate.exe?f=tess&state=4010:ctpa4a.1.1
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(10 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 31, 2009 12:12 PM
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> Look at your logs and determine what key words have been used most to find your site in the past. Use the most common key phrase to create a new domain name. Recreate the site in a different folder using the new domain name, then use a simple javascript redirect in the old index.php file to point the old domain at the new one. Hopefully, by the time you take a hit in SE rankings, the new site will be getting indexed. If you need to have the trademarked brand name in your URL for SEO, create new pages on your site with the brand name. It's not as good as having it in the primary URL, but it's the next best thing and ePN won't (shouldn't) bitch.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------
> One out of every four Americans is suffering from some form of mental illness. Think of your three best friends. If they're okay, then it's you.
Are we talking about trademarked brand name or trademarks?
For example, "Rolex" and "rr" are trademarks.
So you can not use Rolex or rr in your domain, fair enough.
Do people know the hundreds of thousands words that are trademarked out there??
So will you be terminated by ebay if your domain is myRRstore.com ??
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(9 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 31, 2009 06:36 AM
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Using scripting language such as php or asp and a 301 header redirect, I have never had any of the major search engines take more than 3 days to move at least 90% of my pages in thier indexes. It's quite painless.
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(8 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 31, 2009 05:06 AM
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Look at your logs and determine what key words have been used most to find your site in the past. Use the most common key phrase to create a new domain name. Recreate the site in a different folder using the new domain name, then use a simple javascript redirect in the old index.php file to point the old domain at the new one. Hopefully, by the time you take a hit in SE rankings, the new site will be getting indexed. If you need to have the trademarked brand name in your URL for SEO, create new pages on your site with the brand name. It's not as good as having it in the primary URL, but it's the next best thing and ePN won't (shouldn't) bitch.
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Thin isn't thin unless it's OneLung Thin
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(7 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 30, 2009 11:08 PM
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The only thing I worry about is the negative effects this would have on SEO. The other option is to throw them away. No brainer.
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(6 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 30, 2009 10:35 PM
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> Get new domains, do a permanently moved redirect and move on. The only thing I worry about is the negative effects this would have on SEO. > Multiple EPN accounts and been sued for trademark issues... enough said about this user? Multiple EPN accounts ???? Shelby, don't you have anything better to do with yourself. The last thing I expected when I posted this was snide remarks from some troll. Sheesh.
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(5 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 30, 2009 08:43 PM
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Multiple EPN accounts and been sued for trademark issues... enough said about this user?
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(4 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 30, 2009 04:10 PM
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Get new domains, do a permanently moved redirect and move on.
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(3 of 25)
Re: Dreaded EPN Trademark Notice: Comply or Terminate
Jul 30, 2009 03:46 PM
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You're right about the third slash and that is relieving. I'll still have a few sites active with EPN which is nice. The nice thing about Amazon is that they don't police their own affiliates about trademark infringement, this is the responsibility of the companies to do. You will be solely responsible for the development, operation, and maintenance of your site and for all materials that appear on your site. For example, you will be solely responsible for: I've already been sued for trademark violations twice and all the companies want is the domain. They're weren't looking for any "damages" from money "earned"..."thanks"
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