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Last Post Nov 6, 2009 8:20 AM by: fshardy
Replies: 120
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casedwards
Posts: 5

seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 4, 2009 7:15 AM
A seller sold me a pair of pants 2 months ago.
I knew coming from thailand it would takes some time to
recieve the item in the states. I gave it almost 2 months.
At that point I placed negative feedback and contacted
the seller at the same time. I honestly didnt realize
that negative feedback was so hard to have removed or
edit but either way 2 months and something was going on
and negative feeback was how I thoaught you contacted the
seller.

Now the seller sent me a note saying
it was too bad I didnt contact them first or they
would have been glad to send a replacement or refund.
Now I read that and had to send a reply to clarify if they
really meant they were admitting fault but refused to do
anything because of my use of free speach. They
confirmed they would not send a refund unless I removed
feedback. That seems like theft to me.

Ebay wont open a claim because I waited to long. Part of the
problem there is that I work long shifts. Usually around
2 weeks out in the field and then I get back. Seems like
the ebay system may not work in my favor to deal with
such issues. Any suggestions for what I should do? Seems like something should work since they admitted they did not send it and have asked me to remove feedback in order to recieve something they have recieved money for. But due to my schedule and giving more then adequete time to send it I have past the 45 day limit for ebay and paypal.

I would be glad to update feedback to say it was resolved although I am feeling less generous since I am feeling bullyied into doing it.
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casedwards
Posts: 5
(105 of 120)

Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 4, 2009 11:05 PM
At this point I posted a second feedback on the sellers page to close it out and consider it a loss. I tried the route of appology and asking to work with an agreement but it was to no avail. Thank you all for all your help. I learned a lot. I especially like that page that will show me the negative feedback that a seller has recieved before. Some of those were actually similar to what I have experienced.

Just to address a couple things I have seen watching this conversation.

People keep saying that it is unclear if the seller actually shipped the product. This is due to unclear language on the sellers part in a clever attempt to make himself look better. The feedback on his site says "replacement" while the email he sent me says "FYI your order was never sent because PayPal failed to notify us that your pending eCheck payment cleared." If you read that carefully you notice "was never sent" that leaves no questions about if it was sent or lost. The seller has said it was not sent. This is the email that prompted me to make this post because it suddenly went from me thinking I was making trivial feedback to realizing that I clearly didnt have a working knowledge of what I did to make this guy so angry.

wishbetterthings661, you ask how can a seller bully the buyer? Well although I have some empathy at this point for the average buyer who is doing the right thing and cant leave feedback for buyers but buyers can say whatever they want...this situation has the tables turned. This is only possible because I was not carefull with my time. I should have started asking where the product was after a couple weeks had passed but I kept thinking it would take a long time because it was coming from thailand. I work long schedules, mix the two, and by the time I could deal with this issue it was too late to file any claims. So the buyer has my money, my product, and a negative feedback. The negative feeback is the only bargaining chip I have and he wants me to clear it before he will send me pants or a refund. He has already recieved money for this item. So he has all the cards, all the power, and is asking me to remove negative feedback or he will keep it all. That is the picture perfect bully. He holds you in the air ready to punch and tells you to give him your lunch money. You can hold back and you get punched or you can give in and you loose that last thing your holding on to(lunch money) and might still get punched. Or in this situation I could keep the feedback there and at least I know I have made a statement or I can remove it and loose even that and probably still will not recieve a refund. Im sorry if you see me as a bully wishbetterthings661 but although I can see mistakes that I have made in this I can not consider myself at fault at this point. I tried to resolve this issue so that both parties could be satisfied and was denided that. I have recieved nothing for this but it has cost me my money and my time. At this point I believe my time is the bigger loss. I can not reconcile these facts with the red headed bully that you have posted in what seems to reference the buyers as the bully...not in this context without thinking you are making a dig at me. But as you stated, you did not read the whole post so I will accept that appology for being asleep at the wheel, and I will even concede the point that buyers usually have the ability to bully the seller, just not in this case.

As for the rest of you who did read this again thank you. It has been a great learning experience and honestly...Im not sure how worth it buying on ebay is for me. It seems unsafe compared to normal methods of buying and often I can find similar deals locally due to where I live and the strong desire in the area to waste nothing. But if I do use it again I know that I need to be on the seller as soon as I get off each shift so this never happens again.
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duano400
Posts: 426
(106 of 120)

Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 4, 2009 11:39 PM
Yeah, but that showing on OP's account...does not necessarily mean that it cleared the seller's account

Wouldn't it make much more sense that the seller would have told the buyer "you didn't pay us - that's why you didn't get anything" ...

Rather than the seller offering to send a refund or a replacement item?

The fact that the seller offered a refund shows, IMO - they got paid and they know it.

The fact that the seller offered a replacement shows, IMO - the seller was paid and shipped - but the item never showed up.


The very fact that the Seller mentioned a replacement might also indicate he actually sent the items....... You are very one sided in this. It is clear both sides could have done something to correct all this before it got this bad. Remember only the seller can get a negative FB that does a lot of damage to their rep and the buyer can only get nothing or a positive.

Perhaps this buyer doesn't want anything and just wants to leave the Negative FB and be done with it. The whole thing of the buyer not making an effort to contact the seller before leaving the NFB tells me he is blocked on my BBL.

I definitely wouldn't want a buyer like this, and I check all my shipments to see what USPS is doing with my buyers packages and don't archive them until I see they were delivered. But that doesn't mean every seller does that.
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duano400
Posts: 426
(107 of 120)

Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 4, 2009 11:44 PM
At this point I posted a second feedback on the sellers page to close it out and consider it a loss. I tried the route of appology and asking to work with an agreement but it was to no avail. Thank you all for all your help. I learned a lot. I especially like that page that will show me the negative feedback that a seller has recieved before. Some of those were actually similar to what I have experienced.

Just to address a couple things I have seen watching this conversation.

People keep saying that it is unclear if the seller actually shipped the product. This is due to unclear language on the sellers part in a clever attempt to make himself look better. The feedback on his site says "replacement" while the email he sent me says "FYI your order was never sent because PayPal failed to notify us that your pending eCheck payment cleared." If you read that carefully you notice "was never sent" that leaves no questions about if it was sent or lost. The seller has said it was not sent. This is the email that prompted me to make this post because it suddenly went from me thinking I was making trivial feedback to realizing that I clearly didnt have a working knowledge of what I did to make this guy so angry.

wishbetterthings661, you ask how can a seller bully the buyer? Well although I have some empathy at this point for the average buyer who is doing the right thing and cant leave feedback for buyers but buyers can say whatever they want...this situation has the tables turned. This is only possible because I was not carefull with my time. I should have started asking where the product was after a couple weeks had passed but I kept thinking it would take a long time because it was coming from thailand. I work long schedules, mix the two, and by the time I could deal with this issue it was too late to file any claims. So the buyer has my money, my product, and a negative feedback. The negative feeback is the only bargaining chip I have and he wants me to clear it before he will send me pants or a refund. He has already recieved money for this item. So he has all the cards, all the power, and is asking me to remove negative feedback or he will keep it all. That is the picture perfect bully. He holds you in the air ready to punch and tells you to give him your lunch money. You can hold back and you get punched or you can give in and you loose that last thing your holding on to(lunch money) and might still get punched. Or in this situation I could keep the feedback there and at least I know I have made a statement or I can remove it and loose even that and probably still will not recieve a refund. Im sorry if you see me as a bully wishbetterthings661 but although I can see mistakes that I have made in this I can not consider myself at fault at this point. I tried to resolve this issue so that both parties could be satisfied and was denided that. I have recieved nothing for this but it has cost me my money and my time. At this point I believe my time is the bigger loss. I can not reconcile these facts with the red headed bully that you have posted in what seems to reference the buyers as the bully...not in this context without thinking you are making a dig at me. But as you stated, you did not read the whole post so I will accept that appology for being asleep at the wheel, and I will even concede the point that buyers usually have the ability to bully the seller, just not in this case.

As for the rest of you who did read this again thank you. It has been a great learning experience and honestly...Im not sure how worth it buying on ebay is for me. It seems unsafe compared to normal methods of buying and often I can find similar deals locally due to where I live and the strong desire in the area to waste nothing. But if I do use it again I know that I need to be on the seller as soon as I get off each shift so this never happens again.


Well for one in the original post here you said replacement so everyone is thinking maybe he sent it out. Now you tell us that is a mistake.

You left a NFB before contacting your seller to ask what was going on with your items. Your buying habits tell me you may not have been that interested in the items and you look like you are changing your story from the original post. You are confusing people that are trying to help you.....
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duano400
Posts: 426
(108 of 120)

Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 4, 2009 11:49 PM
At this point I posted a second feedback on the sellers page to close it out and consider it a loss. I tried the route of appology and asking to work with an agreement but it was to no avail. Thank you all for all your help. I learned a lot. I especially like that page that will show me the negative feedback that a seller has recieved before. Some of those were actually similar to what I have experienced.

Just to address a couple things I have seen watching this conversation.

People keep saying that it is unclear if the seller actually shipped the product. This is due to unclear language on the sellers part in a clever attempt to make himself look better. The feedback on his site says "replacement" while the email he sent me says "FYI your order was never sent because PayPal failed to notify us that your pending eCheck payment cleared." If you read that carefully you notice "was never sent" that leaves no questions about if it was sent or lost. The seller has said it was not sent. This is the email that prompted me to make this post because it suddenly went from me thinking I was making trivial feedback to realizing that I clearly didnt have a working knowledge of what I did to make this guy so angry.

wishbetterthings661, you ask how can a seller bully the buyer? Well although I have some empathy at this point for the average buyer who is doing the right thing and cant leave feedback for buyers but buyers can say whatever they want...this situation has the tables turned. This is only possible because I was not carefull with my time. I should have started asking where the product was after a couple weeks had passed but I kept thinking it would take a long time because it was coming from thailand. I work long schedules, mix the two, and by the time I could deal with this issue it was too late to file any claims. So the buyer has my money, my product, and a negative feedback. The negative feeback is the only bargaining chip I have and he wants me to clear it before he will send me pants or a refund. He has already recieved money for this item. So he has all the cards, all the power, and is asking me to remove negative feedback or he will keep it all. That is the picture perfect bully. He holds you in the air ready to punch and tells you to give him your lunch money. You can hold back and you get punched or you can give in and you loose that last thing your holding on to(lunch money) and might still get punched. Or in this situation I could keep the feedback there and at least I know I have made a statement or I can remove it and loose even that and probably still will not recieve a refund. Im sorry if you see me as a bully wishbetterthings661 but although I can see mistakes that I have made in this I can not consider myself at fault at this point. I tried to resolve this issue so that both parties could be satisfied and was denided that. I have recieved nothing for this but it has cost me my money and my time. At this point I believe my time is the bigger loss. I can not reconcile these facts with the red headed bully that you have posted in what seems to reference the buyers as the bully...not in this context without thinking you are making a dig at me. But as you stated, you did not read the whole post so I will accept that appology for being asleep at the wheel, and I will even concede the point that buyers usually have the ability to bully the seller, just not in this case.

As for the rest of you who did read this again thank you. It has been a great learning experience and honestly...Im not sure how worth it buying on ebay is for me. It seems unsafe compared to normal methods of buying and often I can find similar deals locally due to where I live and the strong desire in the area to waste nothing. But if I do use it again I know that I need to be on the seller as soon as I get off each shift so this never happens again.


Your last point should be, If I buy international again and 2 weeks go by and I don't see anything I should contact my seller and ask them how it is going with my package to see if something happened, or maybe it is stuck in customs, or maybe like you said the seller is just a big cheat. As I said, I see your ebay id on my bbl. Have fun on ebay and try not to to be to hasty next time.
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madeawrongturn
Posts: 3,957
(109 of 120)

Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 2:44 AM
Buyer is not on my BBL. Buyer has admitted that they made some mistakes and has learned from them. However, it would be a mistake for the buyer to revise the neg now, as the seller does have the upper hand when it comes to refunding or sending the item.

I do not believe the seller, as I read the earlier post from the OP where seller claimed pay pal did not send a message of cleared payment. If that were so, the seller would have long ago checked on the status of payment with pay pal, sent buyer a message asking about payment, or filed the UID.

Yes, the buyer should have contacted the seller first before leaving a neg, and now knows this, but that is not an excuse for the seller to keep the buyers money and the merchandise. IMO, the seller does not deserve the neg removed, as they are dishonest when it comes to fulfilling the transaction.

The seller admitted to not shipping, so the pants or a refund are owed to the buyer, regardless of whether the feedback is revised or not. And if the seller wanted it removed, they would work with the buyer by refunding their money so that the buyer would see them as honest and be willing to revise the feedback, which buyer is willing to do if the seller steps up to the plate and does the honest thing.

I am not defending the buyer for the mistakes that were made on their part, but buyer has owned their owned mistakes in this transaction, but is smart enough to know not to revise the feedback until the seller lives up to their own responsibility as a seller.
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virtualwhimsy
Posts: 26,781
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 5:02 AM
okay sorry I didn't read the entire posts but how in the world in this "new" eBay environment does a seller "bully" the buyer about anything?

Ummmm.. if you had read the thread you would understand what the OP meant by this.



Someone pass me an explanation and a tanq on the rocks please.
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jelynn**
Posts: 799
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 5:32 AM
I went through 11 pages of your sellers feedback to find that last neg and it was self explanatory..nutty.

Nothing lower than 4.8 dsr's and 99.6% positive feedback.

I think it was an honest mistake and they look like they are a BUSY company..maybe they haven't gotten your messages yet?

Anyone reading the sellers feedback wouldn't hesitate buying from them.

JMO
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madeawrongturn
Posts: 3,957
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 6:48 AM
I would. I already read the sellers profile, and the seller has had the same problems in the past with shipments either not being delivered or possibly not ever shipped. Also past history of refusing to refund or ship without a feedback revision. This is dishonest, as a buyer has paid for the item and the seller needs to fulfill their obligation of shipment.

After all, sellers don't like it when buyers refuse to ship an item back when their is an issue unless the seller bends to their demands (also dishonest), so, what makes it okay for a seller to refuse shipping the item the buyer paid for or refunding their payment unless the buyer bends to their demands?
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awesome*possum
Posts: 18,320
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 7:29 AM
m not sure how worth it buying on ebay is for me. It seems unsafe compared to normal methods of buying and often I can find similar deals locally due to where I live and the strong desire in the area to waste nothing

Only if you ignore the protections eBay has in place and/or let the deadlines pass....

I agree that the neg should not be removed until the seller sends the pants or the refund. Not likely to happen, unfortunately.



A timely claim would have gotten the money back.

The seller may still have earned himself a neg, but at least he would have had the chance to rectify the situation.


To address something that was said last night: Pointing out mistakes/bad decisions/etc made on one side of a transaction DOES NOT EQUATE to absolving/excusing/whitewashing/mollycoddling the other side.


If the other side of the transaction were here, I would be all over this seller to cough up the goods.

.


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virtualwhimsy
Posts: 26,781
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 7:37 AM
Pointing out mistakes/bad decisions/etc made on one side of a transaction DOES NOT EQUATE to absolving/excusing/whitewashing/mollycoddling the other side.


Agreed.

Some cannot seem to tell the difference.



Someone pass me an explanation and a tanq on the rocks please.
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bigfanofyours
Posts: 942
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 9:26 AM
Some cannot seem to tell the difference.

Some anti-sellers cannot seem to tell the difference.

There. All fixed.


Charter member of the Seller Protection Squad.
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ima_cheeky_monstah
Posts: 17,414
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 9:31 AM
Pointing out mistakes/bad decisions/etc made on one side of a transaction DOES NOT EQUATE to absolving/excusing/whitewashing/mollycoddling the other side.

Yep


“Never separate the life you live from the words you speak.” ~ Wellstone

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auctionman2k1
Posts: 293
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 11:25 AM
To Casedward

. I tried the route of appology and asking to work with an agreement but it was to no avail. Thank you all for all your help. I learned a lot.

Sorry to hear that! I would have thought the partial refund up front would have been a good compromise.


Im not sure how worth it buying on ebay is for me. It seems unsafe compared to normal methods of buying and often I can find similar deals locally due to where I live and the strong desire in the area to waste nothing. But if I do use it again I know that I need to be on the seller as soon as I get off each shift so this never happens again.


If you can find something on ebay locally for close to the same price. Buying it on ebay is a waste of time. If you something you can't get locally on ebay try not to buy it from an international seller. You can go into the advance search and get results for sellers located in the US only

While you're on your shifts, do you have anyway to check your email? Is there someone who can check your mail for you?


Better luck next time. Best to you...

--------------------------------------------------------
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions..." Thomas Jefferson




SPS - Special Agent Deadpool
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wjhagan1968
Posts: 8
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 10:08 PM
A seller sold me a pair of pants 2 months ago.
They
confirmed they would not send a refund unless I removed
feedback. That seems like theft to me.

.

Actually, it isn't theft it's blackmail and it breaks about 50 national, international and interstate commerce laws.
You tell them you will not be extorted and if they refuse to either give you a refund or send you your item you will report them to the FTC of your particular state. Since they reached into the United States and into your particular state they are under the jurisdiction of both. Just because e-bay is utterly lacking in testicular fortitude doesnt mean you have to be.
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sg51
Posts: 22,348
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Re: seller trying to bully me to remove feedback

Nov 5, 2009 10:57 PM
if they refuse to either give you a refund or send you your item you will report them to the FTC of your particular state. Since they reached into the United States and into your particular state they are under the jurisdiction of both.

Another good prospect for the huff & puff squad.
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